Xymon vs Solarwinds
list Vernon Everett
Hi guys
I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of
control", there's no support, and no backup.
They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and
licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before.
Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard.
From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff
running SNMP, but not so good for anything else.
Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who
can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of
Solarwinds compared to Xymon?
Regards
Vernon
list David W David Gore
May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David
▸
From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett
Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17
To: Xymon mailinglist
Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds
Hi guys
I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup.
They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before.
Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard.
From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else.
Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon?
Regards
Vernon
list Scot Kreienkamp
I've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds. From what I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great for SNMP, and that's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor an F5 load balancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have. On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid
▸
-----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17 To: Xymon mailinglist Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon
This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.
list Phil Crooker
My two bits: It is pretty difficult to alter someone's perceptions (of open source) if they have strong opinions. And when their executive buddies are adding peer pressure and sales reps take them out to lunch and schmooz. But like others said, there are large companies using it. The program really is very professionally done, you just need to know what you are doing to manage it and get the most out of it. Anyway, don't know solarwinds (what a name) but I do know a little about snmp-based systems - they can require a lot more work than xymon. Especially when you want something outside of their canned system and you have to stuff around with the MIBs - it really depends on how inclusive their system is. Plus, poor security with snmp - not that xymon is too good either, but you can dress xymon up in secure clothing if you really have to. The HUGE advantage with xymon is you can monitor *anything*, provided it has some sort of comms, but all monitoring systems require this. You can customise it so that you monitor exactly what you need. And not be bothered by superfluous alarms. Even our dyed-in-the-wool windows guy likes it. A suggestion generally - how about creating a list of companies using xymon in production on the xymon website. I'm happy to collate. cheers, Phil
On 20/10/2011 at 2:17 PM, in message
<user-86a93a5ba63d@xymon.invalid>, Vernon
▸
Everett <user-b3f8dacb72c8@xymon.invalid> wrote:Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's
"out of
control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and
Xymon, who
can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of
Solarwinds compared to Xymon?
Regards
Vernonlist T.J. Yang
▸
A suggestion generally - how about creating a list of companies using xymon in production on the xymon website. I'm happy to collate.
How about improving this list ? Anyone can edit it. http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/System_Monitoring_with_Xymon/User_Guide/The_Xymon_Users_list
cheers, Phil
Thanks tj -- T.J. Yang
list Ralph Mitchell
Somebody already made the Xymon user list. Dont' know how accurate it is at the moment. http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/System_Monitoring_with_Xymon/User_Guide/The_Xymon_Users_list Ralph Mitchell
▸
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:47 PM, Phil Crooker <user-e8e31cd73303@xymon.invalid>wrote:
My two bits: It is pretty difficult to alter someone's perceptions (of open source) if they have strong opinions. And when their executive buddies are adding peer pressure and sales reps take them out to lunch and schmooz. But like others said, there are large companies using it. The program really is very professionally done, you just need to know what you are doing to manage it and get the most out of it. Anyway, don't know solarwinds (what a name) but I do know a little about snmp-based systems - they can require a lot more work than xymon. Especially when you want something outside of their canned system and you have to stuff around with the MIBs - it really depends on how inclusive their system is. Plus, poor security with snmp - not that xymon is too good either, but you can dress xymon up in secure clothing if you really have to. The HUGE advantage with xymon is you can monitor *anything*, provided it has some sort of comms, but all monitoring systems require this. You can customise it so that you monitor exactly what you need. And not be bothered by superfluous alarms. Even our dyed-in-the-wool windows guy likes it. A suggestion generally - how about creating a list of companies using xymon in production on the xymon website. I'm happy to collate. cheers, PhilOn 20/10/2011 at 2:17 PM, in message<user-86a93a5ba63d@xymon.invalid>, Vernon Everett <user-b3f8dacb72c8@xymon.invalid> wrote:Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's"out ofcontrol", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds andXymon, whocan give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon
list Phil Crooker
The problem with this is it isn't "official". For PHBs (Pointy Headed Bosses), it needs to be on the main website, formally laid out. There is no reference to the wikibooks site on xymon.org that I can find, so how would they know? I'm not saying it must be done, just that management types would expect to see things this way, just like they want a "license".... Good list, though. I just added our company. cheers, Phil
On 21/10/2011 at 10:22 AM, in message
<CAD2GW8rbhes=BsEj6oTXFBLJ=+_KEY=user-fef554bd6dcb@xymon.invalid>, "T.J.
▸
Yang" <user-61afc885aa73@xymon.invalid> wrote:A suggestion generally - how about creating a list of companies using xymon in production on the xymon website. I'm happy to collate.How about improving this list ? Anyone can edit it.
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/System_Monitoring_with_Xymon/User_Guide/The_Xym
on_Users_listcheers, PhilThanks tj
list David W David Gore
Yeah the list of companies has already been done and perhaps it needs an update. TJ weren't you the one maintaining that list? Anyway I keep hearing the reasons people give for not using open source but I would think people would make the argument simple, cost. I or we may have to fight the same battle some day with some people using Patrol. To me it is simple, Patrol costs a bunch of money and has been less than stellar on consuming resources and is way less flexible. I would think anyone that anyone that uses buyware should have a strong argument on why the buyware is worth the cost and better than the opensource solution. ~David
▸
-----Original Message-----
From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Phil Crooker
Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 22:47
To: Vernon Everett; xymon at xymon.com
Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds
My two bits:
It is pretty difficult to alter someone's perceptions (of open source)
if they have strong opinions. And when their executive buddies are
adding peer pressure and sales reps take them out to lunch and schmooz.
But like others said, there are large companies using it. The program
really is very professionally done, you just need to know what you are
doing to manage it and get the most out of it.
Anyway, don't know solarwinds (what a name) but I do know a little
about snmp-based systems - they can require a lot more work than xymon.
Especially when you want something outside of their canned system and
you have to stuff around with the MIBs - it really depends on how
inclusive their system is. Plus, poor security with snmp - not that
xymon is too good either, but you can dress xymon up in secure clothing
if you really have to.
The HUGE advantage with xymon is you can monitor *anything*, provided
it has some sort of comms, but all monitoring systems require this. You
can customise it so that you monitor exactly what you need. And not be
bothered by superfluous alarms. Even our dyed-in-the-wool windows guy
likes it.
A suggestion generally - how about creating a list of companies using
xymon in production on the xymon website. I'm happy to collate.
cheers, Phil
On 20/10/2011 at 2:17 PM, in message
<user-86a93a5ba63d@xymon.invalid>, Vernon Everett <user-b3f8dacb72c8@xymon.invalid> wrote:
Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's
"out of
control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and
Xymon, who
can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of
Solarwinds compared to Xymon?
Regards
Vernonlist Allan Jacobsen
Hi Scott I would very much like to be able to monitor our F5s if I could get a copy of your scripts. Best regards Allan Jacobsen Danske Spil A/S
-----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] På vegne af Scot Kreienkamp Sendt: 20. oktober 2011 15:11 Til: Gore, David W (David); Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Emne: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds
▸
I've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds. From what I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great for SNMP, and that's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor an F5 load balancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have . On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid -----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17 To: Xymon mailinglist Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.
list Cami
Hi Scott, I'd like to second that. It would come in very useful at the moment. Regards, Cami
▸
On 2011/10/21 08:35 AM, Allan Jacobsen wrote:Hi Scott I would very much like to be able to monitor our F5s if I could get a copy of your scripts. Best regards Allan Jacobsen Danske Spil A/S-----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] På vegne af Scot Kreienkamp Sendt: 20. oktober 2011 15:11 Til: Gore, David W (David); Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Emne: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds I've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds. From what I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great for SNMP, and that's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor an F5 load balancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have . On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid -----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17 To: Xymon mailinglist Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.
list Martin Flemming
Yep, i'm also interesting for your stuff :-) cheers, martin
▸
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011, Cami wrote:
Hi Scott, I'd like to second that. It would come in very useful at the moment. Regards, Cami On 2011/10/21 08:35 AM, Allan Jacobsen wrote:Hi Scott I would very much like to be able to monitor our F5s if I could get a copy of your scripts. Best regards Allan Jacobsen Danske Spil A/S-----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] På vegne af Scot Kreienkamp Sendt: 20. oktober 2011 15:11 Til: Gore, David W (David); Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Emne: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds I've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds. From what I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great for SNMP, and that's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor an F5 load balancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have . On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid -----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17 To: Xymon mailinglist Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.
list Matthew Moore
▸
Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds andXymon, whocan give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon
I used Solarwinds for monitoring a 1500 node network (all Cisco kit, mainly 1800 and 2800s, with a bunch of 3750s and some of the larger core routers) at $dayjob -1. It's pretty good as far as 'commercial' network monitoring kit goes, quite flexible, good support, sensible price. They had it running ok on a VM so the total cost was quite minor. While it we only used it with SNMP for monitoring networks, it can be setup to monitor servers. I used to use HPs Network Node Monitor v8 and v9 prior to that, which was rather poor for the amount of money we threw at it. I think the initial cost was around 50k which included 3 years support. Overkill for what we needed at that time. Currently using Hobbit 4.2.0 at $currentjob, compared to Solarwinds it's fine, does the job. Maybe a newer version of Xymon is a bit better. I do find the configuration files to be rather labyrinth and confusing, but then I've not really needed to look at them properly to set much up yet. But it does the job fine. Might be because I'm using an older version, I would say that graphically Solarwinds is much nicer. But to be honest all most people actually need is to know if there is a problem with something, so from that point of view the traffic light system is fine. If you had to go for Solarwinds, then it'll do the job, it's easy to setup and their tech support are perfectly good. It's quite flexible really and I'm sure it'll do what you want it to do. I wouldn't say Solarwinds is a 'corporate standard' at all, however. I can think of anyone of a number of other companies that I'd go to for monitoring before going to Solarwinds. I've always been an advocate of the right tool for the job and if that means that some companies prefer commercial software, then sometimes you have to go down that route. Some managers will always want to be able to blame another company for an IT problem, that's just a fact. So if the customer is dead set on it, then you're probably going to have to go with it, unless you can convince them otherwise. Maybe if you show them a nice shiny working installation of Xymon that might convince them that it's actually quite good. If you do want open source IT support (in the UK) then http://www.siriusit.co.uk/ are worth contacting. Cheers, -- Matthew Moore Surgical Materials Testing Laboratory System Administrator Telephone: +XX (X)XXXX XXXXXX Email: user-1738041eebd0@xymon.invalid
list T.J. Yang
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 7:26 PM, Gore, David W (David)
▸
<user-368fd67cc6bd@xymon.invalid> wrote:Yeah the list of companies has already been done and perhaps it needs an update.
It can be updated by anyone any time.
TJ weren't you the one maintaining that list?
I started it up and ran away after doing many "copy and paste" for a while ;) But seriously that list can be updated by anyone. It is just not well-known.
▸
Anyway I keep hearing the reasons people give for not using open source but I would think people would make the argument simple, cost. I or we may have to fight the same battle some day with some people using Patrol. To me it is simple, Patrol costs a bunch of money and has been less than stellar on consuming resources and is way less flexible. I would think anyone that anyone that uses buyware should have a strong argument on why the buyware is worth the cost and better than the opensource solution.
As I won my case by cost plus freedom factor, please be careful you need to let your management know by doing xymon(or any other opensource), in-house resource need to be allocated to support xymon. The support responsibility range from writing scripts, understand xymon , resolving bugs, compile/packaging xymon ... etc. Regards tj
▸
~David -----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Phil Crooker Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 22:47 To: Vernon Everett; xymon at xymon.com Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds My two bits: It is pretty difficult to alter someone's perceptions (of open source) if they have strong opinions. And when their executive buddies are adding peer pressure and sales reps take them out to lunch and schmooz. But like others said, there are large companies using it. The program really is very professionally done, you just need to know what you are doing to manage it and get the most out of it. Anyway, don't know solarwinds (what a name) but I do know a little about snmp-based systems - they can require a lot more work than xymon. Especially when you want something outside of their canned system and you have to stuff around with the MIBs - it really depends on how inclusive their system is. Plus, poor security with snmp - not that xymon is too good either, but you can dress xymon up in secure clothing if you really have to. The HUGE advantage with xymon is you can monitor *anything*, provided it has some sort of comms, but all monitoring systems require this. You can customise it so that you monitor exactly what you need. And not be bothered by superfluous alarms. Even our dyed-in-the-wool windows guy likes it. A suggestion generally - how about creating a list of companies using xymon in production on the xymon website. I'm happy to collate. cheers, PhilOn 20/10/2011 at 2:17 PM, in message<user-86a93a5ba63d@xymon.invalid>, Vernon Everett <user-b3f8dacb72c8@xymon.invalid> wrote:Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's"out ofcontrol", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds andXymon, whocan give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon
--
T.J. Yang
list Ulric Eriksson
▸
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 04:41:50 -0500, T.J. Yang wrote:
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 7:26 PM, Gore, David W (David) <user-368fd67cc6bd@xymon.invalid> wrote:
I would think anyone that anyone that uses buyware should have a strong argument on why the buyware is worth the cost and better than the opensource solution.As I won my case by cost plus freedom factor, please be careful you need to let your management know by doing xymon(or any other opensource), in-house resource need to be allocated to support xymon. The support responsibility range from writing scripts, understand xymon , resolving bugs, compile/packaging xymon ... etc.
A common argument in favor of buyware, especially the really expensive "enterprise" stuff, is that the cost of licenses will somehow be offset by reduced personnel costs. It never works out that way, but by then the money has already been spent and for some reason it seems like less of a waste to keep using the system regardless of technical aspects. It is really hard to argue against this particular argument. "This will save money!" sounds very convincing to non-technical types, while "No, it won't" doesn't. Ulric
list Vernon Everett
Why is it not on Xymonton? :-)
▸
On 21 October 2011 14:35, Allan Jacobsen <user-fd66205ad6a0@xymon.invalid> wrote:
Hi Scott I would very much like to be able to monitor our F5s if I could get a copy of your scripts. Best regards Allan Jacobsen Danske Spil A/S-----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] På vegne af Scot Kreienkamp Sendt: 20. oktober 2011 15:11 Til: Gore, David W (David); Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Emne: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds I've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds.Fromwhat I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great for SNMP, and that's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor an F5 load balancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have . On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid -----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17 To: Xymon mailinglist Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number.Thankyou.
list Scot Kreienkamp
Well, really because I didn't think there was any interest. I asked the list sometime back if anyone had ever attempted anything or wanted to try it with me and didn't get any replies. So I thought it was just too specialized of a use case. Let me go through the script and add a few comments, clean a few things up, and I'll post it on Xymonton. Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid
▸
From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] On Behalf Of Vernon Everett
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2011 7:43 AM
To: Allan Jacobsen
Cc: Xymon mailinglist
Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds
Why is it not on Xymonton?
:-)
▸
On 21 October 2011 14:35, Allan Jacobsen <user-fd66205ad6a0@xymon.invalid<mailto:user-fd66205ad6a0@xymon.invalid>> wrote:
Hi Scott
I would very much like to be able to monitor our F5s if I could get a copy of your scripts.
Best regards
Allan Jacobsen
Danske Spil A/S
-----Oprindelig meddelelse-----
Fra: xymon-bounces at xymon.com<mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com> [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com<mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>] På
▸
vegne af Scot Kreienkamp Sendt: 20. oktober 2011 15:11 Til: Gore, David W (David); Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Emne: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds I've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds. From what I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great for SNMP, and that's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor an F5 load balancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have . On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp
user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid<mailto:user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid>
-----Original Message-----
From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com<mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com> [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com<mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>]
▸
On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David
From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com<mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com> [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com<mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>]
▸
On Behalf Of Vernon Everett
Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17
To: Xymon mailinglist
Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds
Hi guys
I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of
control", there's no support, and no backup.
They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and
licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before.
Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard.
From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff
running SNMP, but not so good for anything else.
Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon,
who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of
Solarwinds compared to Xymon?
Regards
Vernon
This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is
addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is
exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended
recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or
distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying
this information. If you have received this communication in error, please
notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank
you.
This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.
list Ryan Novosielski
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Excellent! Thank you!
▸
On 10/21/2011 09:43 AM, Scot Kreienkamp wrote:Well, really because I didn't think there was any interest. I asked the list sometime back if anyone had ever attempted anything or wanted to try it with me and didn't get any replies. So I thought it was just too specialized of a use case. Let me go through the script and add a few comments, clean a few things up, and I'll post it on Xymonton. Scot Kreienkamp user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid
*From:*xymon-bounces at xymon.com [mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com] *On
▸
Behalf Of *Vernon Everett
*Sent:* Friday, October 21, 2011 7:43 AM
*To:* Allan Jacobsen
*Cc:* Xymon mailinglist
*Subject:* Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds
Why is it not on Xymonton?
:-)
▸
On 21 October 2011 14:35, Allan Jacobsen <user-fd66205ad6a0@xymon.invalid <mailto:user-fd66205ad6a0@xymon.invalid>> wrote: Hi Scott I would very much like to be able to monitor our F5s if I could get a copy of your scripts. Best regards Allan Jacobsen Danske Spil A/S-----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: xymon-bounces at xymon.com <mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>
[mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com <mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>] På
▸
vegne af Scot Kreienkamp Sendt: 20. oktober 2011 15:11 Til: Gore, David W (David); Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Emne: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs SolarwindsI've used both, although I've got little experience with Solarwinds. From what I know of it you already hit the nail on the head. Great forSNMP, andthat's the only way to poll. So if you have a system where you can't turn on SNMP, or the stats you want are unavailable via SNMP, then you can't monitor it. Solarwinds is like any commercial product. You can do what they allow you to do and that's about it. Xymon is infinitely extendable due to Henrik's efforts in many areas and his early design decisions. That's why I run it. Specifically in my case, there is no built in way to monitor anF5 loadbalancer in Solarwinds. While that is also true of Xymon, I did spend a few days writing a script that would interrogate an F5 and report all kinds of information back on its nodes, pools, and VIPs. That would be MUCH more difficult to integrate with Solarwinds. Also, while nobody has asked on the list yet, I would offer it if someone did. Community is a good thing to have . On the other hand, the lack of professional support is frustrating at times, so I wouldn't completely discount them wanting a product with professional support. Also, it looks like at least one company has endeavored to professionally support Xymon, so that may be one way to nullify the support argument. http://www.xymonmonitoring.com Scot Kreienkamp
user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid <mailto:user-462cf0b6d846@xymon.invalid> -----Original Message----- From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com <mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>[mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com <mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>]
▸
On Behalf Of Gore, David W (David) Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 7:35 AM To: Vernon Everett; Xymon mailinglist Subject: Re: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds May be a bit beyond the point at this time Vernon but you may want to point your client to this page: http://support.sas.com/rnd/emi/Xymon/index.html If Xymon is good enough for a billion dollar company perhaps it is good enough for your client. Perhaps making smart decisions on how they spend their money is part of the reason they are billion dollar company. I have never heard of SolarWinds but we are just a support group with no money so there is no reason to look beyond Xymon. ~David From: xymon-bounces at xymon.com <mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>
[mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com <mailto:xymon-bounces at xymon.com>]
▸
On Behalf Of Vernon Everett Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 03:17 To: Xymon mailinglist Subject: [Xymon] Xymon vs Solarwinds Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon? Regards Vernon This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. It may contain privileged, confidential information which is exempt from disclosure under applicable laws. If you are not the intended recipient, please note that you are strictly prohibited from disseminating or distributing this information (other than to the intended recipient) or copying this information. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail or by telephone at the above number. Thank you.
- -- - ---- _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _
|Y#| | | |\/| | \ |\ | | |Ryan Novosielski - Sr. Systems Programmer |$&| |__| | | |__/ | \| _| |user-ae4522577e16@xymon.invalid - 973/972.0922 (2-0922) \__/ Univ. of Med. and Dent.|IST/CST-Academic Svcs. - ADMC 450, Newark -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk6hjpwACgkQmb+gadEcsb7+xQCeJEnF/ItGjvS45O4M0fhzDb7q SwQAn2D6hlFUAd98cj/p8hgfXg26lKYa =CoeM -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
list Asif Iqbal
On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 11:17 PM, Vernon Everett
▸
<user-b3f8dacb72c8@xymon.invalid> wrote:Hi guys I have a client that dislikes open source software. They feel it's "out of control", there's no support, and no backup. They prefer something where they can get "professional" support, and licensed software and all the crap we have all heard before. Somebody at the top, decided that SolarWinds is the corporate standard. From what I have read, it's SNMP based, so great for network, and stuff running SNMP, but not so good for anything else. Has anybody had any hands-on experience with both Solarwinds and Xymon, who can give me a short breakdown of the advantages and disadvantages of Solarwinds compared to Xymon?
In the meantime, why not run both at the same time and see which stands out better? if the decision is based on evidence then it won't be a problem. if it is based on faith/emotion/blah, why waste time in trying to convince? If running xymon requires some understanding which someone is lack off, then why the torture :P We have different departments in our company either running both in parallel or were convinced to switch to xymon completely. Since in our company there is no homogeneous platform and xymon works on all it was easier to stick with it. plus vendor locking was eliminated, which felt good. not to mention I felt good to convince as much as I can to stick with open source.
Regards Vernon
-- Asif Iqbal PGP Key: 0xE62693C5 KeyServer: pgp.mit.edu A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
list Galen Johnson
On 10/21/2011 07:43 AM, Vernon Everett wrote:
Why is it not on Xymonton? :-)
It is...it's on the front page.
list Galen Johnson
▸
On 11/09/2011 01:20 AM, Galen Johnson wrote:
On 10/21/2011 07:43 AM, Vernon Everett wrote:Why is it not on Xymonton?
:-)It is...it's on the front page.
Ignore this...I was replying to he wrong thing...I think. =G=